Photo illustration by Slate. Photos by Drew Angerer/Getty Images and Ethan Miller/Getty Images.
In a span of less than three weeks, the 2020 Democratic nominating contest has been reduced to a one-on-one showdown: Joe Biden against Bernie Sanders. Pete Buttigieg and Amy Kobuchar may have displayed more interpersonal animosity in the earlier debates, but Biden and Sanders embody the fracture in the party’s electorate—the establishment candidate versus the anti-establishment candidate; the old people’s candidate versus the young people’s candidate.
When they face off in Sunday’s debate, they’ll embody the visions of two warring factions: one side solidifying behind a figure who they believe is, above all, the person best equipped to beat Donald Trump, the other side hyper-focused on electing a candidate who promises transformative progressive policies in desperate times.
Online, especially, it’s been a bitter and seemingly irreconcilable struggle. So in advance of Biden and Sanders airing their differences, Slate went looking for people who are living with the contradictions. We found Benjamin and Casey Davidson, a husband and wife who both work at a law firm. He’s in IT support and she’s a document processor. He’s for Sanders, and she’s for Biden.
The Davidson household, about a half-hour outside of Pittsburgh in the battleground state of Pennsylvania, turns out to be divided between the candidates without being at war about it. The debate between Ben and Casey is more about emphasis and expectations than truly conflicting visions. I chatted with the couple about their outlook on the race and their hopes and fears for the country.
Here’s our conversation, edited for clarity and length.
So you two are split on Biden and Sanders. What have those conversations been like amongst yourselves?
Ben: It’s not contentious at all. We’ve been talking about it. I went from Warren to Sanders in late January or something like that, when it looked like he was doing well. I’d ask Casey what she thought. How did you get to Biden?
Casey: A while ago I supported Beto O’Rourke. That was who I intended on voting for in the primaries. Obviously, he dropped out. Then I consulted with Ben and other friends whose political opinion I valued. After weighing all my options, it seemed like Biden might be the most electable. I like Bernie’s ideas and I support a lot of his policies. Just with this election I don’t know if his whole … I like the idea of democratic socialism. I just think it’s too risky in this election.
That sounds very similar to what my mother has said. She is a big Sanders supporter. Then after Super Tuesday, she’s saying, “I’ll probably vote for Biden because it appears as though he is more electable and it’s more doable.”
Casey: People, especially in Western Pennsylvania, when they hear the term socialism—the whole policy scares them and they just aren’t sure how Bernie’s going to pay for some of his big ideas. They haven’t seen a well-constructed plan. So once Beto dropped out, like I said, I was in limbo with who I supported. Just with having discussions with friends and family it seemed Biden is just less of a risk right now.
Ben: Real quick, I think we line up almost 100 percent, Casey and I, on issues. Almost completely. I think the only difference between our support is electability, is who we think other people would like, and implementations of the plans that each candidate has. I’ll say for myself, I do believe Biden will definitely come away with the majority of delegates. If the primary is still active by the time it gets to Pennsylvania, I’ll still vote for Bernie Sanders primarily because last election I felt like I did the opposite thing when I voted for Hillary in the primary. I thought, “I line up more with Bernie, but I’ll vote for Hillary.” Whereas this time I feel like I want to push the agenda and the issues more.
It sounds like you made your decision in 2016 based on who you felt would be more electable. What’s your take on that narrative now?
Ben: I’ve felt the whole time that almost anyone has a really good chance of beating Trump. I think that might even be strengthened by what’s happened over the past few days with the coronavirus response from the administration. I don’t know. Although, I did think that in 2016 too… I honestly don’t know. I’d say that pushing Biden further to the left is more of a concern for me than pushing Hillary to the left was in 2016.
Can you clarify what you mean by “pushing Biden further to the left is more of a concern for me than pushing Hillary to the left was in 2016”? Is your fear that Biden won’t budge as much and that his platform will end up being too milquetoast-centrist?
Ben: I guess I want Biden to be pushed to the left now because I’ve become more convinced, after four years of Trump, that the positions on the left could be more popular with a good messenger selling them. Biden adopting Medicare for All, for example, could be a game changer in terms of public opinion. Differences aside, I don’t doubt his appeal to a broader swath of America than Bernie does.
What worries you the most about Biden as the nominee?
Casey: That he would be unable to keep his composure during debates.
Ben: His apparent cognitive decline and frequent gaffes.
Do either of you worry that Bernie supporters are going to just sit this out if Biden were the nominee?
Casey: Absolutely. That’s what I believe happened in 2016. I’ve heard directly from Sanders supporters who have said they would.
Ben: Yes, but I don’t feel the numbers would be that great. Hillary supporters “sat out” ’08 as well and Obama still won. I also feel that the coronavirus outbreak makes the stakes obviously high. Not voting isn’t an option.
You said that y’all agree that your personal, political agendas pretty much line up on everything. What are some of the things that you disagree on?
Casey: Health care a little bit?
Ben: Maybe. I’m Medicare for All. You’re not?
Casey: Probably not, no. I would say health care is probably our main difference. But I’m open to all ideas. I think that’s one reason we can agree on a lot of issues is we’re both pretty open-minded.
Ben: What about national security?
Casey: I think we’re probably pretty similar. Environment, we’re definitely right on. A lot of social issues we’re right on. We have the same beliefs and views.
Why no Medicare for All for you, Casey?
Casey: Maybe it goes along with my fears about Bernie, how we’re going to pay for it. I’d like to see a plan in place before it happens. I’m not opposed to the idea. I’d like to see more dialogue. I don’t even know a lot about it. So I’d like to learn more and I’d like to see a nice plan in place before we move forward with something like that.
Benjamin, what would your response to that be?
Ben: It would basically be, I’ve come to grips with Medicare for All increasing taxes for people potentially across the board, at least the middle class and up. I don’t necessarily have a problem with that. I guess the only concern I have with Medicare for All, and think she’s probably on the same wavelength, is selling that to the general public might be difficult.
What’s the biggest political argument—about anything, ever—you’ve had?
Ben: Our biggest disagreements concern our views on the Republican Party. Casey feels that there are still good moderate Republicans and that “reaching across the aisle” can still be accomplished. I don’t. I feel that popular movements and working to convince the general public of Democratic Party policies are the way to move forward. We’ve never been in a shouting match over it, or even really raised our voices, but I have a tendency to rant about even centrist Republicans and Casey will shut me down.
What scares you guys about our current political climate?
Casey: Everything.
Ben: Yeah, right now, it’s the incompetence of the current administration and how we respond to national events. The coronavirus being the latest and most current example, do we take it seriously? Do we have the right people in place to take it seriously? That’s just one example. What if a war breaks out halfway across the world? Are the right people in place for that? Anything close to crisis management is a real concern. Casey?
Casey: Everything about the current administration scares me. Anything from social issues to response to coronavirus, economics. I can’t say that I have much faith in our administration, especially given everything with Russia and the Mueller thing. I’ve lost faith in this administration—not that I really had any. But it’s just scary.
What do you both want to see from the Democratic Party going forward? This election and afterwards?
Ben: My big thing is I would like the Democratic Party to really focus more on appealing to working-class people everywhere around the country. Again, going back to the example of Medicare for All, I think there is a way to tell people that Medicare for All is feasible, is viable and ultimately your average costs will be down if you buy into it. The marketing of that, the actual politics of getting buy-in for Medicare for All, everyone stumbles on it. Anything like that. Getting the Democratic Party to be able to appeal to more people, where the core constituencies would be, would be what I want to see.
And you, Casey?
Casey: I think I’d just like to see some unity going forward. I know with the debates and everything there were some attacks. But now, I think we just need to focus on who the real issue is and that’s President Trump. If we can all come together, all Biden supporters, all Bernie supporters, and just have a common goal to get Trump out of office, if we can achieve that, that’s what I want to see, that’s the end result I’d like to see.
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